UK leaving the EU - views

[shameless]

Watch your mouth you

By the way , we're not in the North Sea, we're next to it

quite -we are in the Atlantic -the North Sea is merely a tributary of it which we positioned there to separate us from the French

[Strela167]

quite -we are in the Atlantic -the North Sea is merely a tributary of it which we positioned there to separate us from the French

odd how the little bit changes from a channel to la manche, the sleeve

[timekeeper]

"I believe there are several contributing factors to the Brexit vote. First, there is a revolt against a global elite who seem to believe they know what’s best when it comes to economic and national security. We’ve seen failures of global collective bodies of governance before; the League of Nations is one. And many would say the current United Nations represents another. There is a progressive socialist ideological agenda that seeks to advance a “world government” without borders and therefore, a loss of national identity. It appears the folks in the United Kingdom expressed their nostalgic desire to remain Britons, and identify as such. The insidious and incessant leftist rhetoric of xenophobia and multiculturalism is being rejected — and that’s perplexing and concerning for the progressive leftists. There’s nothing shameful about finding pride and honor in one’s nation, its history and past."

[tribe125]

Left and right played no real part in the referendum. Historically, there have always been mixed views within left and right groupings, whether in the form of political parties or other groups.

It is also not possible, in Britain, to reliably determine levels of national pride by political persuasion.

As far as the referendum is concerned, the picture is too complex for left-right analysis.

[mlcor]

I've gone through this thread with interest, as someone who has never lived in the UK, but has spent a very large amount of time there (more than a week every month for several years, and at least half a dozen times per year for over a decade). There are definitely parallels to the current US situation with Trump. I think he would be a dangerous and horrible president, but he has tapped into a geniune outrage and discontent in a significant portion of the population. They don't know exactly what they want done, but they do know that none of the rascals currently running things will do it. It seems like that's at least a piece of what's going on in the UK.

As someone who has to deal regularly with politicians in Washington, I agree that they have failed us (both sides of the aisle). But I don't think that putting a megalomaniac in charge is the cure. In the case of the UK, it's not at all clear what the medium and long term consequences will be, and anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves.

In terms of the EU, I deal regularly with their mass of overregulation and their ponderous, sanctimonious attitudes, and I can understand why folks would feel stifled. On the other hand, you have to wonder if the EU isn't at least partially responsible for the absence of any European world wars for the past 70 years...

My only hope is that things somehow work out better for the UK, one way or another.

[tribe125]

One thing that may not be apparent to everyone outside Europe, is that Britain has always been a little semi-detached from the EU.

We didn't want to join it when it was created, and then when we first wanted to join, Charles de Gaulle said 'Non!'. It's a long story that hardly matters now, but the factors included The British Commonwealth, Britain's relationship with America and London's role as a financial centre.

It's also significant that we used to call the EU 'The Common Market'. It was perceived to be about free trade. The clause about 'ever closer political union' wasn't taken too seriously. As far as Britain was concerned, there wasn't anything political about the Common Market, so there wasn't any loss of sovereignty.

Britain's semi-detached status was confirmed by it not joining the single currency and by it not signing up to the Schengen Agreement. Other European countries have despaired of us at times...

We've always been equivocal. We've never liked the bureaucracy, we've never liked the idea of political integration - whether we were broadly in favour of the EU or not. Given all of that, it doesn't take a huge mood swing to get the referendum result we had.

General de Gaulle would say: "You see? I told you so."

[whatmeworry]

Interesting take on it all from Guardian comments, basically regardless of the result no one will have the balls to follow through on it. That might almost be as much of a disaster as us leaving, politics is certainly going to be interesting for a while.


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[Seriously]

Originally Posted by Seriously
Apologies if someone has already posted it, I did check tentatively

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215

Lol

Really hope this doesn't happen.
They have already said due to 3/4 of MP's it may be over, then the Lords too
Not a dead cert. yet. Still think a pity not 60:40 or more. At least a wake up call

Up a mere ~400,000 since yesterday when I posted that !

[whatmeworry]

Up a mere ~400,000 since yesterday when I posted that !

Nearly 3m now.

Meanwhile here's another take on things from the Guardian


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[Seriously]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215

3,000,258 signatures

Show on a map
100,000