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Thread: Should college athletes be paid... people outside the US I have a ? for you also

  1. #21
    Scam Hunter Broker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ilitig8 View Post
    My fingers typed blue when I certainly meant grape, I mean purple!
    GRAPE?


    :Faints:

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  3. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Broker View Post
    You know what I really dislike. The inconsistency between baseball, football and basketball. They should each be 2 years of college and then you are eligible for the draft in whatever sport you want.
    I agree that it should all be level especially when football has the shortest career and the longest wait requirement for the draft. But, I say open it up to "finished high school" and/or 18, let the pro teams shoulder the burden of developing the greatest young talents and let those who WANT to be student athletes and get a college education go through the college system.

  4. #23
    Member rfortson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ilitig8 View Post
    I streamed the 30 for 30 piece Pony Excess (about SMU football in the 1980's) last night and that along with all the recent discussions inside the college athletics community got me thinking about it.

    So should college players be paid?

    For people outside the US is this an issue or discussion in your countries? While I know a decent amount about a lot of professional sports outside the US I don't know anything about college/university sports past our borders.
    Too much money being made off these guys without them getting more of it. If they could go straight to the NFL or another pro league and make money off their talents, that would be one thing. But the NFL and NCAA conspire to keep these people from earning what the market will pay. When a player gets suspended for selling his signature, but the school he attends can sell the same thing and keep ALL the money, something's wrong.

    Yes, the players get a nice college education, but many of them are there for football/basketball only. If that's going to be the case, then these players should be better taken care of.

    I wish it wasn't like this (I like the myth of amateur athletics), but the genie is out of the bottle. Best fix it now. The real question will be how it's fixed. The O'Bannon trial has already answered the first question (should they be paid). The "how" will take some work.

    If an 18 year old kid is a genius with programming, she can make millions off her efforts. If another 18 year old plays wonderful violin, he can make all the money he wants. But if an 18 year old is fast and can throw/catch a football, he's prohibited from making money off those talents. All three kids can get full-ride scholarships, but only one is prohibited from profiting off his talents.
    Last edited by rfortson; Dec 3, 2014 at 02:54 PM.

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  6. #24
    King of Mars bolaberlim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ilitig8 View Post
    Let me expand a little for people outside the US. College sports here is BIG business, particularly football and to an extent basketball. The ACC conference alone gets $240 million dollars a year just for the TV rights to its games. In the past (and probably now) there is a large amount of corruption and players and their families are often paid or given things to entice the players to commit to a particular school. Some of the kids come from very poor backgrounds and their families don't have the means to even cover the daily incidental expenses of college life. Given that players must be out of high school before being drafted by the National Football League AND their is no minor league football in the US their only real choice is to play college football if they want to eventually become pro.

    I did not play college football for a big school (actually a very small Division II team) I was initially offered a football scholarship but took an academic one instead since I was FAR more likely to get cut from the team than fall below the GPA required to keep the academic one. My point here is despite being extremely well prepared for the academics of college and not needing much time outside of class to do well, with the time commitment to football it would still have been nearly impossible to have a part time job in order to have a little "spending money". Now had I taken the football scholarship I would have been paid (at today's tuition rates at my alma mater) about $200,000 for four years playing, that would have been great for me since I needed the degree to go on to law school and would have had to pay for undergrad some way. The truth is many of the big time football players at big football schools aren't there for an education and many of them aren't even prepared to take advantage of it even if they wanted to, they are just "forced" to go to college since they can't go pro yet and there is no minor league football for them to pursue for the three years. My point being for a lot of the elite players the college degree (and education) is secondary. The colleges make millions upon millions of dollars off their football teams while they only give back education for a few years and for a significant portion of the players this isn't even compensation they want.

    I personally am not sure how I feel about paying players and certainly don't know how a system should be set up nor the amounts that should be involved. For example I still think the Olympics should be 100% amateur but the Olympics aren't a required stopover on the road to professional sports, if you want to go pro in cycling, track, skiing, ice skating or the like you aren't forced to spend a period of time on the amateur side.

    Just curious how other people feel about it.
    If other people, institutions, companies or whatever are making profit, the athletes should be compensated. If it's that big a business, someone is making loads of money, and I am pretty sure that not everybody will make it in the big leagues- here just 5% or less will ever make a career out of it, and less than one 1% will be successful in that career, and every once in a while you get a Cristiano Ronaldo or a Figo that really make it large- so what do the guys that play get for their efforts? What if they get a career ending injury in college? From what I can understand, if they don't go to college they can't go pro, or have to wait until they go pro? In that case, College is just a way of forced non paid internship, or in other words- free forced labour. Someone is making money at their expense and the kids have no choice in the matter, because they HAVE to do it if they want to go pro and it HAS to be for free. At least that's what I understood from the above. Here college sports is basically amateur.

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  8. #25
    Old but Crafty RayMac's Avatar
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    US Football is probably the exception as just about every other major sport has a D-league of some sort where you can get paid. You might ride the bus, but you'll get pocket money at least.


    Few things are more delightful than grandchildren fighting over your lap. ~Doug Larson

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  10. #26
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    But if we let them all go right out of high school I could see a degradation of the sport that I love. We wouldn't get to see the best of the best for even a short time. Because I don't watch pro sports.

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  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Broker View Post
    But if we let them all go right out of high school I could see a degradation of the sport that I love. We wouldn't get to see the best of the best for even a short time. Because I don't watch pro sports.
    I certainly see that point but that seems pretty selfish, in that "we" want to see them play for free at "our" schools. "We" win the college "wins" and though one could argue the athlete wins as well the "winning" seems disproportionate to me.

    There are a lot of football players (not singling them out just using them as an example) who don't really belong in college except to play football. These are the ones that were it not for football would be out in the work force developing trade skills for a career more suited to them. So they go to college because they have to in order to follow their career path, get hurt making huge money for someone else. They then may not be able to do the trades they were suited for before. Now they have no diploma since they can't play and lost their scholarship and can't afford to finish college. So now their body is broken, they have no trade skills, they have no college degree, they never got paid for their "work" but somebody did.

  13. #28
    Member rfortson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Broker View Post
    No. They get a scholarship and free food. They can always choose to work in the summer and save their money. They just choose not to. I sacrificed in college and they should also. They will get their payday but college isn't the day.
    Broker, I'm not sure they CAN get a job, per NCAA. That's to prevent the star running back from getting a "job" from the local booster where he shows up once a week to pick up a check. There are lots of restrictions that are only placed on athletes (to protect the schools and AA's) that aren't placed on other scholarship holders. It will change soon (the Ed O'Bannon trial saw to that), but HOW it changes will be the big question. I'm not sure our Dawgs and Tigers will be playing the same game in ten years and that's a shame, but hey, everyone got rich (except the athletes) while it lasted!

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  15. #29
    Higher Entity Jeannie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolaberlim View Post
    If it's that big a business, someone is making loads of money

    A little dated (2008), but eye-opening:
    http://espn.go.com/ncaa/revenue


    Quote Originally Posted by bolaberlim View Post
    they HAVE to do it if they want to go pro and it HAS to be for free. At least that's what I understood from the above. Here college sports is basically amateur.
    Well, that's a bit of an overstatement. I'm not as familiar with football since I don't watch it, but in basketball at least, there are other avenues. Currently the NBA rule (known as "one and done") is that the athlete must be 19 and/or a year out of high school to be eligible for the draft. Most interpet that to mean they go to college for a year. Since the NCAA tournament is one of the sports biggest stages at any level, they are given an opportunity to showcase their talents throughout the season and in the tournament. NBA scouts like this as they have a year to watch a player develop at a higher level than high school.

    However the athlete could choose to sit out and not play in organized fashion or could choose to go overseas and play for another country instead. Both of these will likely allow the player less exposure as most NBA scouts are sitting in college arenas and not traveling to Europe, but it can be done and has been done successfully in one or two cases. There's also the NBDL. A UNC player successfully went that route very recently when he was suspended from the Carolina team for stupidity.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P._J._Hairston


    I'm not sure that it's viable for college athletes to work summers for spending money. That's AAU time and they need that to stay competitive. Plus I think there may be NCAA restrictions.

    Jeannie
    Last edited by Jeannie; Dec 3, 2014 at 03:16 PM. Reason: added the bit about Hairston and the NBDL

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  17. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by rfortson View Post
    Broker, I'm not sure they CAN get a job, per NCAA.
    I didn't look it up BUT I think you can have a job during official "vacation" I think is the term and that money is NOT limited BUT the money has to be fair for the job and only for actual work done and can NOT be as endorsement and the employer can't use them for ads and promotion.

    During school I think there is a dollar limit on what one can make and I don't think you can work your freshman year.

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